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Angelcynn: The History of Anglo-Saxon England
The history of the Germanic kingdoms of England, from the Saxon Advent to the Norman Conquest.

Anglo-Saxon History (3 threads, 167 posts)
    The Historical Arthur (64 posts)
    Historical Thread

    The historical evidence ...
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    Mmm, carnage!
    but_no_living_man_am_I.gif
    Author: * Aelfwine Scylding - 12 Posts on this thread out of 1,426 Posts sitewide.
    Date: Jul 15, 2004 - 04:17

    Merlin, a good, balanced review, thanks (a bit spoilerish, but that's all right). I loved this one... "But, the reason for going is for the carnage, and they provided a lot of that." I'm not sure I'll go in for the carnage but I appreciate the frankness! *G*

    I think most of what dismays me about this movie is the surrounding attitude of smugness. See this article about the movie costumes. Can I tear it to pieces? I'm not always such a viper but this morning I feel like it. If you don't want a massive amount of b*tch*ness skip the rest!

    "this mythmaking chapter in the life of King Arthur"
    Er... yes, I suppose whatever is written or filmed will become a part of the legend for future generations, but... do these people really consider themselves on par with Chrétien de Troyes and Thomas Malory?

    "Since this was the Dark Ages, there was not much written about it, but based on the information that we had and with our set designers, our cinematographer, and with our stunt co-ordinators, we worked out a way to photograph it that hopefully will show the way it actually happened."
    Er... let alone the Dark Ages definition... but *what* information they had exactly? I read the article searching for sources, and you'll see what I got! "the way it actually happened": this I call hybris. There are parts of the battle of Waterloo that we don't yet know how exactly they happened.

    “But we used the famous Danish book (The Bog People by PV Glob) that found the clothes in the peat dating from about the year 400 A.D. in Denmark. That gave us a pretty good indication of the cut.”
    Finally a concrete source! I got to that one too when researching for my stories. But do not raise your hopes too high.

    Rose employed three researchers who worked for six weeks, sifting through material at the British Museum and most significantly at Sutton House, a museum in Yorkshire.
    OK, nothing to complain, though I'd have liked more about this "material" and less about "how good we are".

    They traveled to Italy and Spain to source the various costumes and furs. Some, like the standard issue Roman centurion, could be bought off the rack from various warehouses. Others involved a certain amount of ingenuity and wizardry with a sewing machine.
    I'm a re-enactor, and I can't even begin to say all that is wrong with this picture. But I will. "Costumes and furs" don't grow on trees in Italy. Archaeological finds are extremely scarce. And what kind of "standard issue Roman centurion" can you buy? Yes, some historical clothiers in the trade are good, but some are bogus. And "a sewing machine" is absolute anathema, blasphemy, obscenity, when talking about historical costumes. Yes, it's necessary to save time, but don't boast about it!

    “What we tried to achieve with the individuals is that they retained a little bit of their history and they also gathered other things en route in their adult life,” says Rose.
    Yes. That's what I do too. Most of what I own is "stolen from cadavers".

    “The seven of them are kind of fifth century rock stars. They should look sexy and strong and dynamic and interesting."
    Errrrrr... slap a tunic on any man and he's sexy enough for me. (Aelfwine remembers who he's supposed to be and hastens to add "and any woman too"!)

    As King Arthur, Clive Owen had just one request for his wardrobe. “I wanted Arthur to wear a pair of black leather trousers,” he says; Rose gave him the trousers.
    No objection whatsoever to black leather trousers in general. Black leather trousers on King Arthur, well, I hope all the rest hides them enough. No, really, I guess they did had leather braccae, but black leather... doesn't sound right.

    For the classic Roman soldier look, Rose could buy straight off the rack.
    I still want to know what kind of rack... I have a couple of accessories I'd need...

    “The Saxons are very big, ferocious-looking men,”
    Racial stereotype! I feel discriminated! I'm a slim gentle-looking Saxon! *G*

    In sharp contrast to the Saxons are the Woads, guerrilla fighters who strike suddenly and melt back into the undergrowth just as quickly.
    Pet peeve: using modern terms and concepts to describe ancient reality. It is just a turn of phrase, but it indicates how the approach to these ancient realities could be warped by modern mentality.

    Wow, was that sour! Sorry, I'm not usually this way...


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